Optimum exhaust system length?

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Old Apr 9, 2014 | 10:04 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by TNC
Yeah, you leave one sock in an airbox and from then on you're known as a sock stuffer...sheesh!
You guys may think it's funny, but apparently the guy who owned a 70 Honda SL350 I got had some kind of inside information there - two sweatshirt sleeves in place of the air filter wrap!

Then there was the guy who was trying to get his Suzuki TS250 "ready to race"... seemed it was running a bit rich... couldn't have anything to do with the chunk of automobile seat foam stuck in the air box now, could it?

The things you run into working at a motorcycle shop...
 
Old Apr 10, 2014 | 01:31 AM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by klx678
You guys may think it's funny, but apparently the guy who owned a 70 Honda SL350 I got had some kind of inside information there - two sweatshirt sleeves in place of the air filter wrap!

Then there was the guy who was trying to get his Suzuki TS250 "ready to race"... seemed it was running a bit rich... couldn't have anything to do with the chunk of automobile seat foam stuck in the air box now, could it?

The things you run into working at a motorcycle shop...
Or working on a guy's motorcycle at a shop and finding his marijuana stash stuffed under the seat blocking his airbox intake?
 
Old Apr 10, 2014 | 01:45 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by TNC
Or working on a guy's motorcycle at a shop and finding his marijuana stash stuffed under the seat blocking his airbox intake?
now that is friggin hilarious.
 
Old Apr 10, 2014 | 02:36 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by wildcard
now that is friggin hilarious.
And here's the rest of the story. I was a cop for over 30 years. I worked at that motorcycle shop part time as a mechanic for 15 years. The other guys asked me what I was going to do when I found that baggie of MJ. I dumped out the MJ into the used oil drum and put my business card in the plastic bag and put the bag back...except not covering the airbox intake, of course. The business card had my name, our police department, and my position as a Sgt. in criminal investigation. We never knew what happened when that guy found it, but it would have been worth a nickel to be a fly on the wall when he did. All those guys at that shop are still my friends, and we had a good laugh just last week thinking back to that incident.
 
Old Apr 10, 2014 | 03:45 AM
  #15  
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Originally Posted by TNC
And here's the rest of the story. I was a cop for over 30 years. I worked at that motorcycle shop part time as a mechanic for 15 years. The other guys asked me what I was going to do when I found that baggie of MJ. I dumped out the MJ into the used oil drum and put my business card in the plastic bag and put the bag back...except not covering the airbox intake, of course. The business card had my name, our police department, and my position as a Sgt. in criminal investigation. We never knew what happened when that guy found it, but it would have been worth a nickel to be a fly on the wall when he did. All those guys at that shop are still my friends, and we had a good laugh just last week thinking back to that incident.
That is probably one of the funniest, cleverest things I've heard in a long time. What an opportunity too! That guy probably had to swallow a lump the size of a baseball in his throat haha!
 
Old Apr 12, 2014 | 09:35 AM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by klx678
There are formulations for calculating optimum exhaust diameter and length. Don't ask, I don't know. I do know that if someone is doing off road or dirt track racing the exhaust size and length for the bike would probably be good. That has been my experience with the SR 500. I got my numbers from an old Gordon Jennings article where they did a lot of mods and did dyno runs as they did them. The optimum, which I also found on a flat track pipe, was a 1-5/8 ID and 33" in length. There was also power gained by adding a megaphone too. As I said, when I did get a hold of a flat track pipe it measured 33" and was 1-5/8" ID. Dirt track requires a good range of power.

I know it's no help on the 250, but just an example that some "magic" numbers do exist.
Of course; there's always a number that's a good starting point.

Ah for the days when I had my Lincoln mig welder, a chopsaw, and easy delivery to your home of bends and bits.. but paradise has its limitations I guess

I can't find that old forum post-maybe this was it? (from ADVRider) but there's no length mentioned. No matter, I can do some testing .. which is harder than typing off-topic nonsense from behind a keyboard, but more rewarding in the end


My last KLX250, received help from the guy who built the Kawasaki Race team bikes in Australia. It all got a little silly, but fun non the less. Read at your peril.

!. Fitted stock KLX300 barrel
2. Kevin Doyle high comp custom ground piston approx 12.7:1 comp
3. custom ground kevin doyle cams still pulling at 13000RPM nasty
4. Stock ignition opened up to 11750RPM (limited the top HP on my bike)
5. tuff rided (special heat treatment) inlet and exhaust valves
6. D.I.D timing chain ( only need if your going to rev the bejezzus out of it all the time
7. K&N air filter
8. Staintune oversize header and muffler (very loud with cams eh)
9. heavy duty barnett clutch springs
10. revalved resprung forks
11. revalved/stroked rear shock
12. shorter 117mm dog bones
13. FCR35 Keihin, but back to stock KLX250 carby for convenience


I ran this bike in and then took it to the dyno shop. It looked stock and the owner laughed when I told him I thought I would get in excess of 30Hp at the wheel. He even went so far as to show me his hp graphs for stock WR250 Yamaha's. Which on his dyno produced 28Hp at the wheel and 24Nm. The first run on my bike pruduced 34 HP from 8500rpm and 27Nm from about 6500RPM. He fell off his chair and I laughed till I cried. He wouldn't believe it (he thought it was a stock bike with a staintune pipe) so he rebooted the computer on the dyno and we re ran it. Same result and it was funny as it was bouncing off the new 11500 redline at about 170Kph. At this point I had to tell him what I had done. Bear in mind this is with the stock KLX250 carby.

I then fitted up the FCR35 Keihin and we ran it again. I struggled to get the jetting right and it was costing a fortune. But with it running rich all the way through the rev range we got 36Hp and a flat 30Nm. Trouble was it was a pig to ride as I couldn't get the carby right. After about ten million scabbed knuckles, swear words and loss of most of my hair. I went back to the stock carby and sacrificed the few extra hp. The reality is that I'm not fast enought to use it anyway. The civility of the stock carb is like a siren to a sailor. Irresistible.

Kevin ran programable ignitions on the Kawasaki Race bikes and they would not flat line like my bike did from 8500 onwards. However the costs for the programable ECU with the required flywheel mods (loss of electric starter) were too high for me in both $$ and convenience. His bike regularly reved to 13000RPM and they were getting about 40Hp from the 250cc version. YEAH BABY. My bike hit 8500RPM and then held almost the same HP till the rev limiter. The Nm dropped away as the revs increased.



YouTube videos of KLXs with Staintune exhaust systems show a small OD muffler can that's very loud. Too loud! No muffing going on at all from what I can hear..

RIP Gordon Jennings !
 
Old Apr 12, 2014 | 12:07 PM
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I always thought this thing could rev harder! I made a post about it a few months ago, 34hp wow. But definetly not street friendly with top end cams and 13:1 piston
 
Old Apr 13, 2014 | 03:46 AM
  #18  
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Ahm, speaking of exhaust... my box of goodies arrived yesterday including the Made in China megabomb, and - just for fun - a dual exhaust system off a CRF250R I guess it was (both off eBay) ...something to play around with on either the KLX or the XR

The CRF bolt pattern at the engine seems to be the same width, but there may be some fabbing to do

Took 3 months to get here

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Old Apr 13, 2014 | 11:10 AM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Richard Avatar



I then fitted up the FCR35 Keihin and we ran it again. I struggled to get the jetting right and it was costing a fortune. But with it running rich all the way through the rev range we got 36Hp and a flat 30Nm. Trouble was it was a pig to ride as I couldn't get the carby right. After about ten million scabbed knuckles, swear words and loss of most of my hair. I went back to the stock carby and sacrificed the few extra hp. The reality is that I'm not fast enought to use it anyway. The civility of the stock carb is like a siren to a sailor. Irresistible.


RIP Gordon Jennings !
Prepare for my comments on a product I've used for 20 years and know that it works...

If you ever do a carb on a single (or other for that matter) look at what Dick's racing does with their carbs and the testing done by MXA (Motocross Action) magazine to review the carbs. Then take a look at the Thunder Products IntelAjet or the Dial-A-Jet. You jet lean and let the fuel adder do the rest of it.

Few motorcycle people seem to want to accept this set up, but the ATV and snowmobile markets (being much younger) aren't tied to hard brass for jetting. They are doing great with the set up.



I used one on my KLX650 and have yet to change out jets or even alter the Dial-A-Jet from the center setting, in spite of running with the air box lid cut out, a big bore using a Kawasaki Vulcan 1500 piston, and a full reverse cone megaphone exhaust. It worked from the original OEM lean jetted set up all the way through to the modified 678cc set up. Spark plug is always a nice light chocolate brown just like the one on the sparkplug charts, the exhaust tip never black and sooty.

I got my brother to use one now on his KLX250 with air box work and 300 pipe. He did some jetting, but then installed the Dial-A-Jet and found it smoothed out all the dips in the power due to jetting issues. Imagine that, just what I told him it would do. I think he wasted money on the main jets he bought, because the Dial-A-Jet would compensate for them.

I got a pilot jet, drilled the slide, drilled the air jet, and shimmed the needle (only because my brother had a washer of the right thickness), but left the main as is.

Laugh at the Dial-A-Jet if you want, say it's black magic or a hoax, I'll keep using it as will a lot of ATV and snowmobile users who know it works. My engines' performances have proven it to me (KLX650 and Honda Nighthawk S) for the past 20 years. Have fun tearing the carbs down over and over, nicking knuckles, I'll do it once and be done with it, even if adding future mods - including the TM36 if/when I do one since the air boot will still fit and the Dial-A-Jet will still be in it. Set the carb up a bit lean and go for it.

A company cannot survive for 25 years on a product that does not produce results. It can when it does. Check out the media reviews for yourself, while doing so ask yourself "have I ever seen an ad for this product?" and you will realize ad revenue has nothing to do with the evaluations.

I only wish I could afford the dyno time to show the performance that is felt.

Oh, forgot to tell you, my mpg stock was 50 mpg. Now it is always within 60 mpg +/- a couple, with the mods - on a 650.
 
Old Apr 13, 2014 | 11:27 PM
  #20  
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I'm familiar with Thunder Products' add on items, including a couple other things I could use with the a TM carb

A friend of mine in MI who is heavy into snowmobile racing for years (including turbo sleds) often mentioned the Dial-A-Jet.

I have seen though about as many negative forum reviews (seized engine etc) comments about it as I have positive. I haven't looked lately, but a few years back I was trying to see how users felt about it. The premise is sound though isn't it?

Right now I think my jetting is perfect since I leaned out the needle a bit. It even starts and runs a little with the choke pulled out part way-which it didn't do before, and pulls much harder at WOT in the upper gears.

I have some main jets larger than the 135 that's in it due any day now, but I wouldn't be surprise if I'm good - - at least until I do the cam mod!



Since the CRF duals require a shorter header pipe I may just shorten the megabomb header and use it with the duals - double the fun!
 

Last edited by Richard Avatar; Apr 13, 2014 at 11:44 PM.



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