I almost ordered some extra needle jets for the Monster carb, just in case I am going to need them, but then thought to just go with the P8 I'm not using in the TM36 since it's the same series (36mm & 40mm use the same series needle jets btw). Except ...the standard 40mm needle is too fat to use in the P8; I couldn't even insert the needle jet into the carb much before it just stopped..

The stock Y-6 needle jet must be having its flow metered by that large needle to some degree then. There's probably a situation possible where you have a small needle/small ID needle jet and large needle/large ID needle jet doing about the same job of metering fuel.

I sent Niche Cycle a note to see if they can provide any sizing info. lest I order a needle jet that's too small an I.D. and have one or more $13 pieces of brass I can't use at all. If they can't tell me, I'll just have to dig around on the internet some more.

Meanwhile I'll just have to see how well combo that comes inside the 40mm works. The extra stock intake has been ported, and some of the orig jetting has been changed. I just need to give it a try some day.



Just a note that the a/f meter works well. I hooked it up to see what'd happen at idle (TM36), and found the ratio to be hi 14s or maybe it was a little above 15:1, so I richened the idle mix little bit at a time until it was in the very low 13s.

Easy as pie

Slowly revving it in neutral a bit didn't reveal anything way out of whack; still 13/14:1s.

My road is finally being paved (supposedly) and we're due for a few more days of rain, but once it all settles I'll be out getting some a/f ratios at various throttle positions.

Tuning has just gotten much more fun !

 

Hey thanks. It's just some fun mixed with avoiding boredom. More innovation on the way

 

Oh sure! I'll do the a/f readings on the 36mm, probably at various throttle settings I can repeat easily after the MCM, sort out the jetting if it's off, then finally get around to the cam mod.

Afterwards trying to determine how that changes the jetting requirements. Marcelino's bike is FI so his computer adapted it to the change without him doing a thing. If he did a/f readings before and after I don't remember seeing them.

Doesn't matter-I want to know what the MCM does to my jetting and will report back

 

More of that, less lengthy opposing comments

 

I did this to my TM36 a few weeks ago after apparent success with a similar mod to the intake manifold of my XR200, and if the SOTP results match timed video testing when I get my camera in position, I'll have to try it on the 40mm..





I was neutral to pessimistic as I road out to test it first riding the XR200 with its new Webcam, then 2 weeks later on the KLX. If anything I was just hoping the mod would make either bike a kind of wheelie machine and was very surprised when though the wheelies weren't any easier...instead both bikes crossed the finish line of my 1/8 mile test straight (highway) hurtling along at what seemed to be faster than previous speeds, with the Kaw well into 6th gear and still pulling strong on the slight uphill grade. (14/48)

I guess I shouldn't have been surprised at the Kaw's response since the XR seemed to like it, but a couple weeks had passed and the clear memory of the XR's torquey ride had faded to uncertainty as to whether it'd made as much difference to the XR as I thought.

My Kaw speedo wasn't working at the time, but it is now, so soon - along with everything else I want to test I need to confirm what felt like a nice big fattening of torque under the curve for both bikes. I just remember coming away from both rides (weeks apart) with a sense of "whatever it was that just happened - it felt GREAT!"

It's just a .5mm thick section of 1/2" wide pocket rule notched to only require cutting into the carb 1/4" top and bottom covered nicely by the intake manifold's rubber.

 

- After getting apparent success with the added intake divider on both bikes I felt that was enough testing for awhile and focused on getting my O2 sensor bung welded in and other things that don't involve beating on the bikes

Kind of like doing well in the market, then leaving it alone for a few weeks etc

Make sure the 36mm is dialed in with the a/f meter, then the cam mod

Maybe I'll even throw the 34mm CVK back on at some point to examine a/f ratios with that in place pulling air through the drilled air box. Maybe even include the 34mm in video sprint testing, then come back and time the sprint from 30-80 km/h etc while watching the video.

 

You didn't want any educated or researched comments. Like this one that backs up your use of a splitter to smooth flow and make it more laminar.

Thunder Products torque wing, tested by MXA



My using Thunder Products' Dial-A-Jet brought me across this product some time back. Had reviews pertaining to results, positive ones along with some explanation of why it works versus the notorious Tornado. Imagine that! Something learned without actually having to buy a bunch of stuff and try it out.

There were also earlier comments in other posts about the flow into the mouth of any intake, made long ago, pointing out the effects of sharp corners on turbulence in air flow. Learned a lot about it in Fluid Power class and working with an air flow situation in my time as a quality engineer, not to mention that it has been mentioned over and over in performance automotive magazines, but it seems that doesn't mean anything.

Why is it so difficult for you to accept that I may actually have some knowledge and save you some wasted work and money? Not everything I have is negative and every bit of it is open to discussion. Virtually every comment I make has some merit and some discussion might actually alter both your and my perception. That was how I worked as an engineer - troubleshooting involves multiple points of view to open new vistas and avoid stagnation.

Your recent post on air flow opens the whole flow thing, getting people to realize how smooth flow and turbulence affect the intake. I've commented on that before - but I don't have a youtube video, just written word.

Don't be afraid to learn from others. I'm not. I'm impressed with some of your initiative, especially the splitter. Read the stuff on Thunder Products, you might add the horizontal plate to yours.

I also see a couple things that makes your earlier air box mods interesting - the forming of PVC to make a smooth intake horn for one. I did a similar adapter when I fitted a 24mm Mikuni in place of the 24mm IRZ on my old Sherpa T. The IRZ had a larger mouth to fit the air boot. I had to form a PVC adapter. I did a bit of shaping, but knowing what I know now I would have made it a longer smoother transition.

You see, I do have some experience and can add some to the mix... if you want it. If not, I won't. But realize I do have both experience and knowledge that can be of value to you and others as you do for others and myself.

 

 

Not quite so..

Positive comments moving an idea along in the OP's general direction are of course welcome. Contrary opinions that seem to be more a chance for the person replying to (once again) list where he's been, what he's read, and list arbitrary reasons why it just absolutely will not work..are not only counter-productive to the end goal, but out of the norm.

"Norm" meaning, if you compare typical thread views to the number of replies, you'll see most (90%?) of the people just read it and don't comment at all. Even though I am sure many of them could dig up or recite reasons why something won't work OR talk about other items they've run across-but they don't.

Every forum has its resident expert ..ask him what time it is, and he'll tell you how a clock works-at length. Same thing in real life at the local coffee shops etc. Someone 'talking over' the other guy who's just brought up a subject seemingly in a hurry to tell all who will hang around what he knows.

Btw, I posted about drilling my air box way back in February, now here it it is almost into August, and evidently no one here, including the experts, has bothered to take off their seat at a dyno or the carb boot off to try and establish whether air is/is not able to get to the air box and filter in sufficient quantities to satisfy demand.

I've listed the liters/per second demand @ high rpm for the 250 and big bore 350 engine, and brought the air box subject up again now and then. Yet there's been no discussion at all regarding KLX air box efficiency. I mean just for the mental exercise if nothing else... but nada

The search for power begins at the beginning of the intake tract.

Not everyone wants to ventilate their air box of course, but the fact that not even the experts have tried it just confirms that they are more about telling what they've done/what product they've used in the past, than they are about following up on someone else's idea, moving away from the keyboard and actually doing some experimentation in the present day.


IMO, if help is not specifically asked for, or unless the OP is about to make a huge mistake that will damage his engine or himself, then I personally don't see where it's proper to bluster in with one's life history and arbitrary warnings of how it just ain't gonna work.

I don't know when or if you mentioned the ThumperProducts 4 vaned carb wing thing to me as you're alluding to. I posted a pic sometime ago here showing a single horizontal divider in the aft section of the carb..which essentially generated no further interest as well. Yes you mentioned about sharp corners, but since it was something I already knew there wasn't anything else to say about it.. I had already removed the Gates rubber hose that cost only a couple dollars to try thinking maybe removing the bend in the tube would offset the sharp corners. Dodge Viper owners used to routinely replace their 2, ribbed, slightly curved, air box to TB tubes[/URL] with straight sections of angle cut Gates type hose, a mod often claimed to be worth 5hp on that engine, so that's the experience I was coming from. It was cheap to try while waiting on my box of farkles. The tubes in the pic actually were standard equip on the ACR model Viper and may have had a bend molded into them..but the aftermarket ones were just angle cut at each end.

Nowadays though, as I look at this extra air box I have, sharp corners are staring me in the face. I posted about it to pass on the info to everyone here. Which is a few levels higher than just talking 'theory' and specifically gets into showing how this applies to our particular bike. Different than just lobbing as many ideas up as possible into other people's threads and hoping something sticks..

It's all good, or can be, but maybe if someone has a product they want to talk about, or even just talk about themselves, they should start their own thread instead of sort of hijacking someone else's?

@Matt..I was going to post a pic of Rodney King haha

 

It's too bad that I can't get useable knowledge from his posts.. There is just too much chest thumping and posturing to parse out ... Oh well ... I am stoked on installing a bell or horn into the box under the air filter. Could be the next big thing for us Richard.